Allerlei Technikdiskussionen (1 Betrachter)

DX12 confirmed for a console. Only Xbox One could have it. Biggest surprise ever to come at 2014 E3
March 6th, 14:34


Misterx: DX12 confirmed to be announced. Full HSA 2014 tech: Detailed here since 2012 by Insider, Mistercteam. Parasite and other great contributors.

CPU = CPU + small supporting GPU(DX11) = 1st layer on Xbox One.
+
GPU = GPU(DX12) + small ARM cores = 2nd layer on Xbox One.
+
innovative memory system = embRAM + move engines + other accelerators
=
full HSA.

Revolutionary tech. Makes nested parallelism algoritms(raytracing) possible in real time. Efficiency is up to 4 x times for the same cost of silicon as today.

developed by Microsoft + AMD + IBM
co-depeloped by ARM, SAMSUNG

licensed by Nvidia and Intel.

DX12 will first fully implement it on API level.

Xbox One game console is first hardware to support it, Microsoft forced TSCM and other hardware fabs get stacking and 22nm ready very early ahead of time already in 2013. 3 billion project for RnD.

Mistercteam: http://misterxmedia.livejournal.com/111251.html
http://dualpixels.com/2012/11/29/ru...y-hardware-and-third-party-softwear-next-gen/

I will break it down the important highlight from it :



Plus Dx12 is also this year (thanks to Gokakoka)
and Truth for other link

pay attention to Qualcomm


gforce1981: Excited and nothing but great news

Hi guys,

You can really tell how excited everyone is about the Xbox One, this journal has gone from talking nearly exclusively about hardware, specs, and all that stuff to nearly non stop about the games and how much fun everyone is having.

I really have to give it to MS because that is what they said from the beginning, let the games do the talking.

Do I believe the Xbox One has extra stuff that we don't know yet (absolutely) and I think everyone is getting a really good feeling now with everything that has been coming out that MS have a lot of surprises in store for us.

Things like Biggest Surprise at E3 Every, DX12, tiled resources to be fully implemented, even hints to stuff like Qualcomm and second layers.

Shit is getting real guys.

Remember ages ago I brought to the attention about all of the lies that sony was spinning and how they have been getting found out that they are doing it again. Well that is the same information I had been telling people many years ago when I used to post on Semiaccurate. I kept on saying to people why put your trust in Sony when they have lied to you SOOOO many times before.

xdlugia2: I am getting my hopes back up again. What I believe is that the DX12 update is what's supposed to unlock everything in the Xbox One.
Think about it, they had to rush it out this year because of Sony, so they implemented a custom DX11 format to the console because DX12 wouldn't be ready until its originally planned release in 2014.

I'm not a huge tech head, but this makes very much sense to me! Greatness awaits lol

Mistercteam: Want to laugh , as people consumed with Sony Style & SDF, to think DX12 is reaction to mantle? What?

DX certainly already in the works since ages ago
a lot longer than mantle

in fact mantle is just like some other member on tech site
mantle is just a way of AMD try to prolonged the life of
GCN 1.0 or 1.1

Did we forget that Sea island is supposed to be late 2012-middle 2013
then also NVidia late to the party too

Dx12 is because they will try to use what MS already cooked for the last 5 years (like research pdf etc), basically on game console
it is what X1 lower layer is

They try to use new architecture that will merge /fusion
in the real sense, when GPU is become 1st Class processing system
beside CPU.

If we believe sony fans or many SDF way of thinking that try
to do inverse logic, do we think MS can create DX12 in very short time
of course not

it is why on the list of partner is include all the big boys
include AMD (the one that create mantle)

GCN2.0 or probably R10, and real Maxwell
include Qualcomm GPU (ex imageon AMD) is all will introduce
new GPU architecture, all will be well served under DX12
it will introduce SM 6.x and Compute Shader 6.x

Parasite76: There is talk of Microsoft acquiring insomniac, a Microsoft co funded and timed exclusive for FF7 remake and free Xbox 1 with five year Xbox live membership. Grain of salt

Misterx: Microsoft said this E3 they will have biggest surpise ever. That could be only one really big surprise - Xbox One fully supports DX12 and have 2nd layer to do this. Xbox TV, VR glasses, illumiroom is ok but not big enought. Maybe Nin buy by Microsoft. But Microsoft don't need that in my opinion as Japan software houses and especially intendo are trailing behind by 3 to 5 years in GFX progress and game engine creation.

Mistercteam: More and more Xbox one is certainly 2014 console, Biggest E3 , Dx12 etc
- They said this Year E3 will be the biggest
- They only hinted last year, as they can not show the full potential (yes this full potential as insider said will be revealed on at stages)
- now the SDK, is more mature,
- DX 12 that always hinted since 2010,2011, many insider info insist
MS will reveal DX 12, and now it is a reality.
- Once again the Dualpixel rumor 2012 is making sense right now
- everything start to getting more inline.

Microsoft on DX12 announce: "However, you asked us to do more. You asked us to bring you even closer to the metal and to do so on an unparalleled assortment of hardware. You also asked us for better tools so that you can squeeze every last drop of performance out of your PC, tablet, phone and console. Come learn our plans to deliver."

Misterx: Still waiting for TF surprise.

Misterx: Check out this great Granite SDK with Tiled Resources implementation

gforce1981: Just wanted to point this out and this is why we wont see it in mainstream games for a little bit.

http://graphinesoftware.com/node/70

Graphine released Granite SDK v 2.0 today (December 10th 2013)!

With the second major update to the Granite SDK, we introduce three main improvements over the previous iteration that help bring visually impressive experiences to life and enable that next level of graphical detail.

"First off, we have added hardware tiling support. On DirectX this is called “Tiled Resources”, but there is also an OpenGL equivalent under the name of “Partially Resident Textures”. Hardware support means that using our technology you will not only have to run less instructions in the shader, but there will also be a reduction in cache sizes (video memory), because no extra pixel borders are needed for cross-tile hardware texture filtering."

I know some people might say that maybe the PS4 can do this also with the partial resident textures, but they have to deal with slower latency GPU Memory and the XBOX One was simply designed on ALL areas to work with this.

"The pixel data is highly compressed, using state of the art image compression techniques. The Granite SDK compression systems are specifically tuned for game specific data types, such as normal maps and alpha channels. Our tools quickly and efficiently convert your source art to our streamable file format."

*** the xbox one has specific decompression / decoding hardware... (move engines) the PS4 will have to use more of its CPU or GPU.

"The Granite SDK works independent of a particular graphics API and allows you to plug it in at any level in your game engine"


UPD:
Misterx: LOL at GG explanation - yes it 1080p but not native.

mrzweistein: "In Multiplayer mode, however, we use a technique called “temporal reprojection,” which combines pixels and motion vectors from multiple lower-resolution frames to reconstruct a full 1080p image. If native means that every part of the pipeline is 1080p then this technique is not native."

Yes, exactly this is meant by the games community as far as I can remember, GG !!! IT IS NOT NATIVE AND THE ONES WHO BELIEVE YOU ON THIS ARE NA_IVE

Insider Daily. DX12 Xbox One vs DX11 PS4. 2014 tech vs 2012 designed GPU. Sony forces Ubisoft to lie
March 8th, 14:52


Misterx: Does MS feel competition from Mantle? If yes that means AMD started their own HSA game? Seems like MS try to PR DX away from Mantle..

Any mega info to confirm?
- ff7 xbox one exclusive
-subscription model(well you talked about it singe 2012)
-MS bought Nin?

Also any update on illumiroom? Maybe still to happen?

Insider: The ceo has left.. I wonder why.. the uncharted guru has left. One off there first party studios got closed... hhhmmmm I hear they definitely couldn't pay to fund that remake. And a test demo of s3 is getting shopped around now and with sega's blessing and publication licence agreements.. 30 / 100million needed to fund this baby

No downgrade on watchdogs gfx on x1 @ 960p... but the textures lighting are a lot better then the other one... but come e3 I dont think this will mater well I seen wd direct sdk and something is not right???? May be the fix will come down on e3 night...

on last thing hf2 is good.. defiantly above the others.. could be exclusive from story going around.. but still something better would be a cranky witch and sher sisters

Parasite: Guys you aren't going to like this but my source's have told me there is a huge push to make watchdogs inferior on Xbox one to take the momentum building going into e3 away. Look for resolution gate to be a big part. Ubisoft from the pressure of Sony will not convert the ddevelopment over to take advantage of new ask. My source also told me the game is a rehash AC anyway.

Misterx; That is not gonna end well.No Watch Dogs for me if it will be as bad as looking on PS4.

Misterx: Well, DirectX 12 confirmed for Xbox One. Stacked GPU and local CLOUD on the way.



DX12 Xbox One vs DX11 PS4. 2014 tech vs 2012 designed GPU. A generational leap difference. This time there is a huge difference between generations because of full HSA(see first HSA benchmarks - there is 3 to 5 times speed bump compared to current PCs).

All previous GPU iterations usually gave us 10% to 30% speed bump compared to previous years GPUs. Now it could be 300-500% bump for the same silicon size.

The problem is - AMD and Nvidia will choose to shrink die size and get the power up only by 30-50% every year. Not the whole 300-500% at once.

On Xbox ONe there is a little bit different story. All the hardware already in Xbox One. They also cut die size and power comparing to full HSA PC GPUs chips by 45% according to insider to make stacking possible but it is enough to be on pair with PCs for 5-6 next years with slow decline from year 5.

I think OpenGL could not copy DX12 features this time because those features hardware based. Software emulation is always 50 to 100 times slower or in some cases is simply impossible.

Neogaf is in denial. More and more people realized how Sony brainwashed them over n4g.com, neogaf,com and other corrupted sites. Things could change very fast and those lairs will be executed by the community.

Now Microsoft should show us DirectX12 tech in motion. Hope for a great presentation. Last several years Microsoft did not invest their employers time to make great inspiring tech demos everybody will talk about.

Mistercteam: Here on MrX, we repeatedly said DX12 will be for X1 too
it is same as X360, even this time insider said as X1 GPU is fully programmable there is no DX restriction anymore(misterx- remember a statement "every game on xbox one have its own game os").


Xbox 1
1st of its kind
1st to do Fully hardware Coherent
1st to do 3d stacked
1st to do Big-little-GPU processing (3 lane processing concept)

Also above all
MS played us a little bit,

look at DX 12 announcement
at first only AMD,Intel, Nvidia & Qualcomm

People speculated, X1 is not capable
if you see most forum other MrX blog
people (mostly) still thinking X1 is not powerfull
as they still thiking top layer, still thinkig cloud is internet
cloud, yes it is true, but X1 have 2nd layer (or any other jargon you like), local cloud, dGPU, 2nd layer whatever.

Then Today MS updated its MS blog page
plus official twitter hinted it
Officially Xbox also DX12+ (i give a plus sign, for any upcoming further DX enchancement)

Just Like X1 lauch
when they already stated on Arch panel
people keep downplaying it
when people or neogaf already know PS4 is 192 ops/cycle
when poeple already know Jaguar only has 2 Execution unit or 2 FPU unit
it can only do 3 ops/cycle
Operation is not Instruction, Operation is Floating point operation.

MS is attacked, with bad image
DRM fiasco
People Laugh with the top layer spec as the spec for the whole X1

On top of that people forgot 3 Billion R/D VS <200 Million Sony RD for PS4 (read the last year financial report, when they said less than Cell RD is result of using off the self part)

Good Job,
Well played MS, well played !!!!!

Ubisoft insider: DX12 is almost ready. In april MS send beta SDK (DX12) to most X1 developers. Full version DX12 is expected in June. E3 2014 will be great

Misterx: Buy buy Sony. Some brainwashed gamers will still love you because of your games. Some will try to forgive but will refuse.. Honest and respect is very important. Massive lie and brainwash could never be forgiven.

Migration from Somy 1st party studios had already started. Sony could not allow pay much as others anymore. Some could not cover the lie anymore.


UPDATE
Insider: There has been a brake down between respawn and Ea... respawn are open to an exclusive licence agreement with tf I.p with ms... ea say's no ... the 24 hours is vital for exclusive rights to future versions.
Also major issues with severs client side.. ms had to change sever loads management due to major difference in beta/ alpha to final retail. Early severs have offload bandwidth management issues. The resolution will be alpha locked but the game is dynamic resolution. There is going to be alot of patch rework. 960p there still patching for but 60fps lag free servers are priority. I think this is the real critical test for xbox one cloud server side. Dont expect bf4 issues tho.. all of this will not matter come e3.. you all know whats there nothing now will matter.

Misterx: Alpha or beta? If Alpha than it is 720p and CBOAT was right with this(wrong with textures quality) If beta it is 792p and CBOAT was wrong both on textures and resolution. While 960p patch still on the way.